Automotive Improvement

"lorem ipsum" (nothing123456789) 12/31/2013 at 16:02 • Filed to: Car Future Improvement

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Each new generation of the BMW 3 Series or the Volkswagen Golf or the Mercedes S Class is, as one would imagine, better than the previous. It's the natural and (mostly) forward progression of nearly everything, except, for some reason, Chevrolet, who think that adding random bits of black plastic anywhere they can makes their cars desirable. So why, then, do I feel like cars aren't actually improving that much? Oh, they're getting stronger and lighter and faster and safer and more economical, but so much of the improvement made to cars these days is with an adjustment to a computer. There aren't a huge amount of mechanical engineering advancements in the auto industry taking place at the moment. In fact, the biggest advancements are monocoque chassis technology and the double clutch gearbox, both of which I'm pretty sure are actually magic and, as such, don't count as mechanical engineering. Different materials are being used, but even suspension and axle technology come from the 60s. The Lamborghini Aventador, for example, uses the same sort of suspension (push-rod) that was used in the Lotus 22 F1 car. Similarly, the Ferrari 458, one of the most advanced cars on the planet, uses double-wishbone suspension, which, according to a quick Wiki-check, was invented in the 1930s.

So what's the deal? All the better damping and better four wheel drive systems, all the airbags and automatic wipers, LED headlights and lane-departure warnings, radar guided cruise control and emergency braking systems, are a result of fiddling around with a computer. That isn't to say they're not amazing bits of technology that make life more convenient for many (and allow for safe texting and driving), but that the mechanical engineering going into cars seems to have plateaued a bit. New improvements in cars are almost always aerodynamic or electric in nature. The headline technology on the LaFerrari isn't its massive V12 engine (which is basically the same monster it's been since the Colombo engines of the 40s), it's the KERS system, the electric motors, the domain of the electrical engineers. I find it hard to believe that we have reached the peak of mechanical engineering, and understand the best ways to distribute forces and energy throughout a car. Since I know about as much about engineering as George W. knows about…well, anything , I can't really talk. It seems, though, that the rate of improvement for mechanics is decreasing, and being replaced by better electronics.

What, then, is going to be the peak of the car? When even a Ford Fiesta will be made out of carbotanium with an electric motor/battery combination that gets 500 miles out of a 20-minute charge, what will Pagani be building? And when will that peak be? It appears that the last big obstacle to overcome is fuel sources. And, if automakers decide to move forward with electricity, then the battery is the biggest thing to work on. Once (I doubt this is an if ) scientists find a way to make a small, lightweight, high-capacity, and quickly-rechargeable battery, there isn't much left to develop. Sure, the expensive technology will need to be more wide-spread so that everyone can have magnetorediarrhealogical dampers and 700 bhp 4WD Daewoos made from Kevlar and ectoplasm, but I think the car as we know it is reaching its peak very rapidly. I think the culmination of the car will occur when they look like they did back fifty years ago, weigh next to nothing, are as safe as tanks, and go like Caterhams. I'll give it another hundred years.

Manuél Ferrari > lorem ipsum 12/31/2013 at 16:11

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I dunno. I think Chevy has been making big improvements recently. Their new models look a LOT better than the stuff they were making in the 90s and early 2000s.

A lot of their cars are affordable. Is it fair to compare their progress with Ferrari?

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > lorem ipsum 12/31/2013 at 16:14

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So much of the engineering advances you don't see. There have been big advances in piston design lately that nobody outside of those involved with projects actually see. All the consumer hears about are power or mileage numbers, they don't hear about the engineering that got those gains.

lorem ipsum > Manuél Ferrari 12/31/2013 at 16:21

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Well, aesthetics are too subjective to argue over, but companies like Volkswagen and, lately, Peugeot have been making affordable cars that look not-so-affordable. To me, and this is just my opinion, Chevys look like they cost as much as they do. I might have a somewhat badly-calibrated sensor for this sort of stuff, though, since Audis always looked cheaper than they were to me.

lorem ipsum > You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much 12/31/2013 at 16:23

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Where have you heard about this piston stuff? I thought that since Chrysler invented the whole hemi thing way back when, piston technology hasn't improved in great leaps and bounds. Would be very interested to learn more about this sort of thing.

Manuél Ferrari > lorem ipsum 12/31/2013 at 16:27

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I don't pay close attention myself because I'd rather buy a used luxury car than a new affordable car. I'll take the higher fuel and maintenance costs in exchange for the better drive and looks.

Textured Soy Protein > lorem ipsum 12/31/2013 at 16:27

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A lot of cars still need to get lighter after having gotten overly bloated in order to comply with safety standards. So a lot of the advances going forward will be in developing lighter/stronger materials. None of which is just making some computer tweak.

A lot of other improvements are both mechanical and because of better computers. For example:

Transmissions keep getting more gears. They're controlled by computers, but just upgrading the computer doesn't give you more gears. The better computers improve shift times, and are more likely to select the optimum gear for a situation.

Suspensions get better because of adaptive dampers. The mechanical part is what allows the damping to be adjusted on the fly, and as computers get better they are better at making the adjustments.

More capable engine computers allow for more precise control of fuel & spark, which allows for running leaner fuel mixtures at higher compression ratios. More power and more mileage. But there needs to be an accompanying change in the physical design of the motor.

So yeah...it's not just the same mechanical gubbins with more computers. The computers allow newer better mechanical gubbins.

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/31/2013 at 16:39

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This. Would you rather have a new Honda Accord or a nice E90 3-Series? If you've chosen the accord you can hand in your oppo card please.

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/31/2013 at 17:20

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Funny thing is I bet a lot of people on Oppo would say the Accord ;)

I get why a non-gearhead would get the new Accord. If you don't care about cars or know anything about them then there is no point in getting the bimmer.

And I get why a gearhead would get a new Fiesta or Focus ST over a used car. It's fun to get a performance car that nobody else has hooned yet.

But I would never buy an Accord/Camry/etc over used options at the same price point.

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/31/2013 at 17:26

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You and me think alike. Every time I see car I think of at least 5 better cars that could've been bought for that price. It's a problem. I like the Fiesta ST though.

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/31/2013 at 17:31

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It drives a person mad sometimes thinking of all the options you have at a price point when used cars are factored in!

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/31/2013 at 17:35

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Why, why did you buy that Acura RLX for $62 thousand dollars?!?!?

You can tell a Finn but you can't tell him much > lorem ipsum 12/31/2013 at 17:43

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Used to work in industry at a piston manufacturer. They are doing a lot of work to minimize weight, reduce friction and everything by optimizing geometry. Also fully formed piston heads like the Ford Ecoboost pistons, stuff like gallery cooling, pinhole geometries are all being studied like crazy. And I'm sure a lot of the other "invisible" components are seeing a lot of similar work too.

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/31/2013 at 18:06

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There is an Acura that's not an NSX that costs $62,000???

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/31/2013 at 18:08

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Yes! That's pretty much new M3 money! I'm going crazy!

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/31/2013 at 18:11

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Is it FWD?

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/31/2013 at 18:21

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Had to look it up... I actually gasped when I discovered that yes, it is in fact FWD! People who buy this need to reevaluate their decisions.

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/31/2013 at 18:22

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LOLOLOLOLOL

There is nothing wrong with getting an affordable FWD car.

But $62K for a luxury FWD car? Ewww

Brian Silvestro > Manuél Ferrari 12/31/2013 at 18:23

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Fiesta ST: Good buy! Fun Car!

Acura RLX: Oppo suicide, what the hell is wrong with you

Manuél Ferrari > Brian Silvestro 12/31/2013 at 18:24

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Used Acura NSX: oppo hero!

Ansel > lorem ipsum 01/10/2014 at 22:54

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wtf is this bullshit

ScreenShot > lorem ipsum 01/10/2014 at 23:25

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Ford...V10

ScreenShot > Ansel 01/10/2014 at 23:57

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HDR - and someone clearly went overboard w/it.

DownTheLiffeyOnADonut > lorem ipsum 01/11/2014 at 05:24

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The bigger question is over the future of the car itself. Mechanical engineering improvements are irrelevant if cars become self-driving satellite controlled personal transport modules. If you're not doing the driving vehicle dynamics start to become unimportant except for ride quality. Of course this doesn't mean self-drive cars cease to exist; off-road and track activity will continue, but these will be more niche so fundamental changes or improvements in the mechanical bits will become more expensive to deliver.

Finally, the article is quite dismissive of software, but the fact is software means you can get the oily bits to work better; look at aircraft; the F-16 and F-15 are pushing 40, its mostly software that's kept them up to date, not fundamental changes to their airframes (yes I know there's more carbon in their airframes than 40 years ago, but they aren't fundamentally different airframes).

lingenfelter > Manuél Ferrari 01/11/2014 at 07:35

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New cars are essentially a nonoption for me because the used marketplace offers substantially better value for cars that are just one or two years old, and if I'm looking for a project or something with more garage hours required, the value goes even higher. You just have to know what you want.

lingenfelter > lorem ipsum 01/11/2014 at 07:38

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The industry hasn't stagnated. Even if the concepts remain the same, the engineering behind weight reduction and materials improvements requires significant work, even moreso when you factor in the increased expectations of consumers (make all these weight and material improvments, but also try to increase efficiency, reliability, and lifespan of the components too, will ya?)

09GT - now boosted > lorem ipsum 01/11/2014 at 08:09

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Sorry - double post

09GT - now boosted > lorem ipsum 01/11/2014 at 08:11

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If, by "random bits of black plastic", you are referring to the FUNCTIONAL vents on the C7 Corvette, then you sir know nothing about automotive improvements.

Bluecold > lorem ipsum 01/11/2014 at 09:03

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Read up on the direct injection wiki page. And not just the bits that say that direct injection has been around for a while. Modern electronically controlled direct injection coupled with electronic spark and valve timing, EGR, turbocharging and a lot of very sophisticated cilinder head/piston crown design is downright magical since you have one engine that can function as a small efficient engine, or a big thirsty powerful engine at the flick of a switch.

RW53104 > lorem ipsum 01/11/2014 at 09:14

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"magnetorediarrhealogical dampers"

Yes.

Manuél Ferrari > lingenfelter 01/11/2014 at 14:58

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So true

Used cars are always a better value if you know what you're doing

I hate how brand new cars depreciate.

Frankenbike666 > lorem ipsum 01/11/2014 at 17:45

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Electric car things that are left to develop:

Low mass hub motors that can also eliminate friction brakes

superconducting motors

all sorts of innovation in cooling motors and using higher temperature wiring

it will take years to find all the tricks you can pull and refine when you have motors on all four wheels (it could turn in place running one side in the opposite direction)

Active camber change...on all four wheels.

More active aerodynamics

Better refinement of electronic steering assist and more uses (like Ford's primitive use of it for anti-torque-steer purposes)

The only reason it seems like there isn't much to do with electric cars, is because they're currently so primitive that the main focus of engineering is to pull the most distance from a current, sad battery. Once we get past this current era of batteries that take ten times as much space and weigh four times what a full tank of gas weighs to get half the distance out of (if that), engineers will be free to take on more refinement tasks and actually innovate.

norcalsmog > Bluecold 01/11/2014 at 20:26

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I absolutely agree with you. I have a 2011 Sonata 2.4 6 speed auto and the combination of power, low rpm torque and mpg continues to amaze me. I can average mid 40s easily if I cruise around 65-70 Sure, the injectors are a little loud, but that can be resolved with more insulation.

It's a revelation over the older simpler injection systems, much in the same way sequential port injection was over tbi or carburetors. I love the LS1 in my z28, but the new vvt di smallblocks with 4 cylinder mode on even the manuals are just incredible to me. I can't wait until they start showing up in wrecking yards and on craigslist, it will be an amazing swap motor.